Curse

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 03:57 AM // 03:57

Healing Breeze
For 10 seconds, target ally gains health regeneration of 3...8

Here are the comments from Wiki:

Quote:

* At 9 health regeneration this results in 180 healing, if the target never reached its maximum health while the enchantment was active. That's 90 healing per 5 energy (Divine Favor bonus not taken into account).
* If the target is not facing a critical situation (very low on hit points, facing high damage dealers), then this is a solid healing solution.
* The fact that it heals the target over time (HoT), may give you some additional room to turn your concentration towards other allies.
* This is, however, an expensive skill and can quickly drain your energy.
* Also a great spell to make short runs through dangerous areas, as it can be activated as you enter the danger, and mitigate the health lost as you move through. Areas such as lava are examples of a good place to use this skill.

I started this thread because many times in-game I encounter people (In PvP areas) who rage-quit once they see someone use Healing Breeze. I used to use it as a monk (back when I monked), and saw no problem with it. I actually -preferred- this skill. Recently I have seen this skill take so much hate by players saying that it sucks.

Why I think this is a good skill:
-10 Energy, heals for 180+Divine Favor (Ultimately heals for the same as heal other)

-Cast it when you're kiting. It's a great heal to throw on someone (or yourself) as you see an enemy approaching, and you know you're going to need to kite

-Helps to mitigate/nullify the effects of degeneration while hex-removal skills and condition removal skills are recharging (not every team runs divert and RC)

-Helps to mitigate -ANY- DoT (damage over time)

-GREATLY sets a monk up for using certain elites that are better-effective when an ally is below 50% Health. For example, if player x is taking a good bit of aggro and the monk is running ZB or WoH then throwing a Healing Breeze on player x allows for the monk with ZB or WoH to more accurated use the additional effects of their skill, which otherwise would prove more difficult.

Those are my few reasons why I find the skill VIABLE in PvP. I am in no way saying: "OMG! Healing Breeze is the BEST Skill EVER!", but rather "Healing Breeze can be an effective addition to a monk build if used well". I absolutely understand that in no way should Healing Breeze be used to 'save someone about to die', but rather act as a preventative and help the monks set-up for more efficient heals. The versatility Healing Breeze has is almost irreplacable, because it is efficient under a variety of circumstances.

I also understand it costs 10 mana. Wow, 10 mana, e-drain right there... Just like how Heal Other and Jamei's Gaze e-drain you. Oh wait, Heal Other and Jamei's Gaze can't be used on the caster... Oh wait, Heal Other and Jamei's Gaze are hardly efficient while kiting... Oh wait, Heal Other and Jamei's Gaze are less versatile... I am -not- saying that Heal other nor Jamei's Gaze are bad heals (in fact they can be very good heals), but I am saying that people complaing about the mana cost of Healing Breeze, while many of these people use Heal Other or Jamei's gaze O_o

As I said earlier, I am simply asking "Why do people feel that Healing Breeze is a skill not fit for PvP due to its low quality."

-EDIT- Or have I been completely mis-informed and everyone loves this skill...? V_V

Dracil · Mar 14, 2007, 05:05 AM // 05:05

1) Health gain too slow when someone's being spiked to death. If they aren't being spiked to death, you probably didn't need this much health gain so a lot of it will be wasted.

2) Can be shattered or corrupted or descrated or etc., rendering a waste of energy and probably extra damage to the target.

3) DoTs: When someone is being heavily degened, and has something like 19 degen, your Healing Breeze just wasted 10 energy for 0 healing because they're still at the 10 degen cap. Basically, every pip of degen over 10 reduces the effectiveness of your healing breeze by a pip.

4) Related to the above, it doesn't stack well with Shield of Regeneration because the cap works for health gain as well (which has the same issues really, but at least SoR halves spike damage with the +40 armor which is usually when you'd need such a big heal)

5) Doesn't benefit as much from Glyph of Lesser Energy as 15e spells

6) Monks, theoretically anyway, in PVE shouldn't be taking damage, so the inability to heal self in the spells you mentioned is not important

7) Most healing monks seem to use healing touch for self heals anyway, which heals about 150 for 5e

8) Gift of Health heals 141 at 14 Healing Prayers for only 5e. But since it's not usually used by healing specs, it will still heal 105 at 10 Healing Prayers for Prot monks

9) Instead of throwing HB on someone <50% health and then RISKING your ZB or WoH not going off before it passes 50%, why not just cast them first? They all have the same casting time. Casting two spells in succession takes more time than 1. Furthermore, after casting ZB or WoH after the HB, all that regen will probably be wasted as overheal.

10) Preventing damage is better handled by prot monks anyway.

What it comes down to is this, HB is not "bad" per se, but there's usually a better option out there that you could be using for that slot.

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 05:18 AM // 05:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dracil

1) Health gain too slow when someone's being spiked to death. If they aren't being spiked to death, you probably didn't need this much health gain so a lot of it will be wasted.

2) Can be shattered or corrupted or descrated or etc., rendering a waste of energy and possibly extra damage.

3) DoTs: When someone has 19 degen, your Healing Breeze just wasted 10 energy because they're still at the 10 degen cap. Basically, every pip of degen over 10 reduces the effectiveness of your healing breeze a pip.

4) Related to the above, it doesn't stack well with Shield of Regeneration because the cap works for health gain as well (which has the same issues really, but at least SoR halves spike damage with the +40 armor)

5) Doesn't benefit as much from Glyph of Lesser Energy as 15e spells

6) Monks, theoretically anyway, in PVE shouldn't being hit, so the inability to heal self in the spells you mentioned is not important

7) Gift of Health heals 141 at 14 Healing Prayers for only 5e. But since it's not usually used by healing specs, it will still heal 105 at 10 Healing Prayers.

8) Preventing damage is better handled by prot monks anyway.

What it comes down to is this, HB is not "bad" per se, but there's just better options out there.

Well I understand that every skill is more or less 'conditional' and if the monk isn't going to spec in Prot (because the other monk theoretically would be prot/heal) then Mo/E is unnecessary and thus the glyph wouldn't be wasted unless you were running an aegis chain.

-19 degen is assuming you're versing a HEAVY hex/condition team, in which case the monks should be prepared to handle a moderate amount of hexes, so it would not be degen to the point of nullifying the effects of HB.

Yes, there are primarily two types of builds... Spike and pressure... Prot. is the preventative for spike, healing is the preventative of pressure. Spike deals a large amount of damage on a single player in a given instant, whereas pressure deals damage over time... Thus, Healing Breeze is in fact a viable option against pressure, WHILE the prot monk is the option for spike, and generally in PvP circumstances there is both a prot monk and a healing monk (or two prot/heals; not going to mention two heal monks for obvious reasons).

Shield of Regeneration isn't the only viable prot build out there; I'm talking about a coordinated team where the monks understand each others build and don't step on each others feet (by both bringing HoT skills).

Yes, -any- enchantment (save SB and SF etc... of course) can be shattered, removed, desesecrated... that doesn't make them any less viable... Just because prot Spirit can be removed doesn't stop people from bringing it and using it.

Yes, preventing damage is a prot monks job. I am not talking about preventing damage, I am talking about Healing over time (to handle pressure).

Thanks for the reply, but I hope you can understand me when I say that I am not satisfied with those reasons for claiming Healing Breeze to be a mediocre skill.

Kit Engel · Mar 14, 2007, 05:23 AM // 05:23

Because, if you're getting spiked, it's kinda useless, and if you're getting pressured, Guardian, Shield of Absorption, and similar spells absorb much more effective damage than healing breeze heals.

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 05:25 AM // 05:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kit Engel

Because, if you're getting spiked, it's kinda useless, and if you're getting pressured, Guardian, Shield of Absorption, and similar spells absorb much more effective damage than healing breeze heals.

You mention protection spells, I am talking about a Healing Monk not specced in Prot. Not every efficient monk build has to split its attributes between prot, heal, and divine favor.

The Prot monk is responsible for Spikes, the Healer is responsible for pressure. Those are ultimately the primary roles behind 'prot' and 'heal'.

Kit Engel · Mar 14, 2007, 05:29 AM // 05:29

Actually, healers generally do spec into prot, if just for prot spirit or shield of absorption. Prevention is better than cure. Preventing the damage ahead of time leaves you greater room to catch unexpected damage, hexes, or whatnot later on. So generally, efficient monk builds DO split attributes like that.

Also, prot has all your condition removals and stuff.

Prot for spikes, healer for pressure is a pretty bad concept, since it's just not true.

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 05:35 AM // 05:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kit Engel

Actually, healers generally do spec into prot, if just for prot spirit or shield of absorption. Prevention is better than cure. Preventing the damage ahead of time leaves you greater room to catch unexpected damage, hexes, or whatnot later on. So generally, efficient monk builds DO split attributes like that.

Also, prot has all your condition removals and stuff.

Prot for spikes, healer for pressure is a pretty bad concept, since it's just not true.

Ah, so you claim that Absolutely EVERY decent monk build out there specs in all 3 areas and that if you do not spec in prot you must automatically be bad?

If not, then stay on topic where I'm addressing a healing monk, not a prot monk.

Dracil · Mar 14, 2007, 05:35 AM // 05:35

Haha wow, while I was editing my post over that time period, I didn't notice all the posts that had appeared.

Anyway, your reasons for why it's good:
-10 Energy, heals for 180+Divine Favor (Ultimately heals for the same as heal other)
->There are more efficient spells

-Cast it when you're kiting. It's a great heal to throw on someone (or yourself) as you see an enemy approaching, and you know you're going to need to kite
-> You can cast any other spell while kiting as well. Healing that 180 now or 180 over 9 seconds is still 180 healed.

-Helps to mitigate/nullify the effects of degeneration while hex-removal skills and condition removal skills are recharging (not every team runs divert and RC)
-Helps to mitigate -ANY- DoT (damage over time)
These two are really ONE reason

-GREATLY sets a monk up for using certain elites that are better-effective when an ally is below 50% Health. For example, if player x is taking a good bit of aggro and the monk is running ZB or WoH then throwing a Healing Breeze on player x allows for the monk with ZB or WoH to more accurated use the additional effects of their skill, which otherwise would prove more difficult.
-> As I mentioned, this is actually riskier to do because you're LESS likely to get the conditional to go off

So basically, your only useful reason is anti-degen. Also, if you are talking about Healing monks, why are you mentioning ZB?

Kit Engel · Mar 14, 2007, 05:38 AM // 05:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphic Divinity

Ah, so you claim that Absolutely EVERY decent monk build out there specs in all 3 areas and that if you do not spec in prot you must automatically be bad?

If not, then stay on topic where I'm addressing a healing monk, not a prot monk.

Sans farming builds and similar situations, pretty much yes. Go look, even LoD monks usually carry protective spirit or reversal of fortune. WoH often carries prot spirit.

I confess that I'm not familiar with pure healing builds with no protection aspect at all. (Even SB/Infuse often takes prot spirit...)

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 05:40 AM // 05:40

Ah, then forgive me for assuming that any semi-decent monks exhisted who did not have points in Protection.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dracil

Haha wow, while I was editing my post over that time period, I didn't notice all the posts that had appeared.

Anyway, your reasons for why it's good:
-10 Energy, heals for 180+Divine Favor (Ultimately heals for the same as heal other)
->There are more efficient spells

-Cast it when you're kiting. It's a great heal to throw on someone (or yourself) as you see an enemy approaching, and you know you're going to need to kite
-> You can cast any other spell while kiting as well. Healing that 180 now or 180 over 9 seconds is still 180 healed.

-Helps to mitigate/nullify the effects of degeneration while hex-removal skills and condition removal skills are recharging (not every team runs divert and RC)
-Helps to mitigate -ANY- DoT (damage over time)
These two are really ONE reason

-GREATLY sets a monk up for using certain elites that are better-effective when an ally is below 50% Health. For example, if player x is taking a good bit of aggro and the monk is running ZB or WoH then throwing a Healing Breeze on player x allows for the monk with ZB or WoH to more accurated use the additional effects of their skill, which otherwise would prove more difficult.
-> As I mentioned, this is actually riskier to do because you're LESS likely to get the conditional to go off

So basically, your only useful reason is anti-degen. Also, if you are talking about Healing monks, why are you mentioning ZB?

Elaborate on the 'more efficient' spells that offer more than HB does with its versatility

Sure you can cast other spells while kiting, but if you have a KD warrior on you and another member has a BoA and Shadow Axe warrior on him, then you can't conveniently stop to heal him at your leisure; you've got time for two spells and need to get moving.

Since when is it bad for peoples health not to go below 50%?
If I see 2 warriors gank 1 ally, and cast HB as he first begins to take damage, and they fail to get him below 50% I scratch my head in confusion... if they are decent and put out a good bit of damage then Heal Breeze gives me -that- much longer to use WoH or for the prot monk to use ZB.

I was referencing a duo-monk team like most teams... I was assuming the second monk would be prot and that with my examples that at least one of the monks brought a 50% conditional skill.

Ensign · Mar 14, 2007, 05:50 AM // 05:50

Healer's Boon Monks spec very lightly in Protection (usually just some dump points for their emergency Dismiss or Mend Ailment). I don't know of any other bar without a meaningful Prot spec that's been relevant in well over a year.

Peace,
-CxE

Kit Engel · Mar 14, 2007, 05:50 AM // 05:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seraphic Divinity

Ah, then forgive me for assuming that any semi-decent monks exhisted who did not have points in Protection.

I detect sarcasm. There aren't enough decent healing skills around, as a matter of my opinion and limited experience, to build a full bar around them that remains effective in a wide variety of situations.

In PVE, you may be able to get away with it in very limited, conditional situations, such as when you have a bonded tank taking all the damage already, and all you have to do is patch him up. I still usually see people using straight heals over it, even if only just Orison (which is comparable taking divine favor into account).

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 05:57 AM // 05:57

Only as sarcastic as the truth involved in mostly pure healing/divine favor monks. In other words... if there are no well-founded healing builds besides Healers Boon, then no sarcasm what-so-ever ^_^

Just trying to get facts straight as to why Healing Breeze is mediocre at best, so forgive me if I get overly defensive while playing Devil's Advocate.

FoxBat · Mar 14, 2007, 06:08 AM // 06:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

Healer's Boon Monks spec very lightly in Protection

Which incidently, doesn't work on healing breeze.

Sometimes I've seen breeze on ele flaggers/skirmishers, when you've only got one slot for a targeted heal and you need it to be versatile enough to handle yourself and an npc. All a solo enemy can typically do is mild pressure so this can be useful there, plus it lasts a little longer with an enchanting mod.

But anyway, even if you did want to run a healing prayers bar, breeze is still a poor choice. People take heal other so they can have a big, emergency heal without the dangers of infuse; if you are facing mild pressure, which is all healing breeze can counter, a lousy orison is more efficient per mana cost at 12+ divine favor. And there's much better heals than orison out there.

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 06:14 AM // 06:14

Yes, I <3 Healing Breeze on the E/Mo Flag Runner.

IMO Healing Breeze > Orison simply because HB can handle a variety of situations Orison can not, and HB is ultimately only replacable by SoR or Spirit Light wep.

Kit Engel · Mar 14, 2007, 06:16 AM // 06:16

And you are correct in that. Breeze is decent for people who don't have divine favor. Which means, pretty much never for monks.

Though there's Restful Breeze in Nightfall now.

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 06:22 AM // 06:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kit Engel

And you are correct in that. Breeze is decent for people who don't have divine favor. Which means, pretty much never for monks.

Though there's Restful Breeze in Nightfall now.

Oh yes, restful breeze :b I forgot about that.

Anyways, I appreciate everyones input and am now satisfied with the results. TYVM for your time and for the positive feedback, it was very helpful ^_^ This has just been nagging at me for some time now, just wanted to know -exactly- why people go "OMGWTFBBQATTACK" when they see a monk dish out a Healing Breeze.

In other words... I no longer have a question on the topic and if this topic would be better off closed, then so be it.

Lutae · Mar 14, 2007, 06:23 AM // 06:23

Why you wouldn't usually use healing breeze:

Situation 1: Ally has taken over 180 damage. Why would anyone want to heal that damage over 10 seconds with Healing Breeze, instead of healing it immediately via use of Heal Other / Jamei's Gaze?

Situation 2: Ally has taken less than 180 damage, and is not taking further damage. Healing breeze would be overheal, and thus a waste of energy. Orison or Dwayna's ftw.

Situation 3: Ally has taken less than 180 damage, and is taking further damage. Ok, let's use healing breeze to start healing the current damage and reduce future damage... oh wait, isn't this protting? Shouldn't I be using a protection skill instead, or even better, letting the prot monk do his job?

Seraphic Divinity · Mar 14, 2007, 06:41 AM // 06:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lutae

Why you wouldn't usually use healing breeze:

Situation 1: Ally has taken over 180 damage. Why would anyone want to heal that damage over 10 seconds with Healing Breeze, instead of healing it immediately via use of Heal Other / Jamei's Gaze?

Situation 2: Ally has taken less than 180 damage, and is not taking further damage. Healing breeze would be overheal, and thus a waste of energy. Orison or Dwayna's ftw.

Situation 3: Ally has taken less than 180 damage, and is taking further damage. Ok, let's use healing breeze to start healing the current damage and reduce future damage... oh wait, isn't this protting? Shouldn't I be using a protection skill instead, or even better, letting the prot monk do his job?

My previous post states the question has been answered

1) I never said use Healing Breeze to save someone.

2) If he's not taking further damage then simply use another healing spell... that's what they're there for.

3) What are you talking about? Yes, Protection is obviously called for in this situation, but in no way does a prot monk regen an allies life over time, which is what this is calling for.

Ensign · Mar 14, 2007, 07:11 AM // 07:11

You only really see Healing Breeze on E/Mo or equivilent monk secondary characters that have reason to be in healing already (Heal Party) and want a self-heal or other supplemental heal on top of it. As weak as Healing Breeze might be in that role, it is the only skill available in Healing Prayers that can heal yourself (all of the others are 5 energy skills that are dependent upon Divine Favor to be effective).

If a character does not have a need to be a monk secondary, he's better off taking Weapon of Warding instead of Healing Breeze in virtually all situations.

Peace,
-CxE